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Roadmap for SEPHP 4.10!

    • Moderator
    • 379 posts
    August 10, 2017 1:13 PM EDT

    We have a roadmap for version 4.10! It has some details on new features and improvements coming. One of the biggest things is removal of flash. :) You can read more in our blog!

    Enjoy!

  • gs
    • 149 posts
    August 10, 2017 7:51 PM EDT

    Glad to see this, and (give or take depending on actual DoR) less than a yr after 4.09.

    RE Smileys/Emoticons: Will these download as individual files/http requests or more like fonts are?  I ask because a 3rd-Party Plugin I use now creates about 80 http reqs on almost every page, just for their Smileys/Emoticons (so I turn this off).

    RE Removing Flash: All I can say is Thank You (oh, and Woo-Hoo!)

    Question#01: Any clue which FRs will be addressed in upcoming 4.09.04/05/etc? Since SE has been averaging one revision (depending on ones version scheme) update per month my hope is that many FRs could be knocked out before 4.10, esp since you all have done such an excellent job killing so many old (and some new) bugs with 4.09.xx versions.  I thought SE was planning to begin addressing the FRs after 4.09.03.  I'm just trying to see what else will be addressed in upcoming months, or if I'll have to revert to original plan of paying Devs to modify Core (which I want to do about as much as I want to hit my head with a 5# sledge).  I guess what I'm getting at is which of the many other FRs will be addressed, or will 4.10 now interfere with their development?

    Question#02: When will licensing (keys, checks, etc.) be addressed?

    Question#03: When will elimination of Dev Cores be addressed?  I currently have 5 sets of Cores downloading on almost every page (even pages that don't use any Plugins from that Dev, such as the Login and LP that use items from only 1 3rd-Party Dev).

    Thx.


    This post was edited by gs at August 10, 2017 8:07 PM EDT
    • 13 posts
    August 10, 2017 8:42 PM EDT

    I really like the new features and enhancements. I also have a question about smileys, could you provide more information about it? Why not convert database to utf8mb4 and use emojis?

    • 19 posts
    August 11, 2017 3:26 AM EDT

    It's great to see that most of the features were from the community requests! Thank you for listening.

    • Moderator
    • 379 posts
    August 11, 2017 4:58 AM EDT
    gs said:

    Glad to see this, and (give or take depending on actual DoR) less than a yr after 4.09.

    RE Smileys/Emoticons: Will these download as individual files/http requests or more like fonts are?  I ask because a 3rd-Party Plugin I use now creates about 80 http reqs on almost every page, just for their Smileys/Emoticons (so I turn this off).

    These will be basic smileys like you see in this TinyMCE for now. As we are rolling out releases quicker, we need to take smaller steps. We can improve these after we do the work to make them work in all text areas.

    RE Removing Flash: All I can say is Thank You (oh, and Woo-Hoo!)

    lol me too

    Question#01: Any clue which FRs will be addressed in upcoming 4.09.04/05/etc? Since SE has been averaging one revision (depending on ones version scheme) update per month my hope is that many FRs could be knocked out before 4.10, esp since you all have done such an excellent job killing so many old (and some new) bugs with 4.09.xx versions.  I thought SE was planning to begin addressing the FRs after 4.09.03.  I'm just trying to see what else will be addressed in upcoming months, or if I'll have to revert to original plan of paying Devs to modify Core (which I want to do about as much as I want to hit my head with a 5# sledge).  I guess what I'm getting at is which of the many other FRs will be addressed, or will 4.10 now interfere with their development?

    4.9.4 will have a few bug fixes but this release focuses on our certified marketplace and enhancements for that. We will have a lot of great things coming in upcoming releases. As we get closer to those, we'll put out roadmaps for those.

    Question#02: When will licensing (keys, checks, etc.) be addressed?

    4.9.4 if I am grasping what you are asking.

    Question#03: When will elimination of Dev Cores be addressed?  I currently have 5 sets of Cores downloading on almost every page (even pages that don't use any Plugins from that Dev, such as the Login and LP that use items from only 1 3rd-Party Dev).

    Thx.

    4.9.4 for license callbacks. As they need their utilities, we are trying to come up with a solution for that as it could create more load if you have to load the same files x the amount of plugins you have from a developer. 

     

    • Moderator
    • 379 posts
    August 11, 2017 4:58 AM EDT
    Stepan said:

    I really like the new features and enhancements. I also have a question about smileys, could you provide more information about it? Why not convert database to utf8mb4 and use emojis?

    I have no idea how he's coding it. I just know we couldn't get it into 4.9.4 as it requires more extensive coding for it to work properly with our safety filters.

    • Moderator
    • 379 posts
    August 11, 2017 5:00 AM EDT
    Eugene Sutula said:

    It's great to see that most of the features were from the community requests! Thank you for listening.

    Thank you Eugene! Yes these upcoming features were on our list for a while now. Glad you like them too. We hope this will help experts make more new cool stuff too. laughing

  • August 11, 2017 8:38 AM EDT

    Seems like SocialEngine 4.10 release has something bigger stored in for the community users! The new features are quite impressive, waiting for another sneak peak for this release. Kudos to SocialEngine team for their hard work.

    • Moderator
    • 379 posts
    August 11, 2017 8:47 AM EDT
    SocialEngineAddOns said:

    Seems like SocialEngine 4.10 release has something bigger stored in for the community users! The new features are quite impressive, waiting for another sneak peak for this release. Kudos to SocialEngine team for their hard work.

    Thank you! We'll have more coming later on. :)

  • gs
    • 149 posts
    August 11, 2017 1:07 PM EDT

    ==>"These will be basic smileys like you see in this TinyMCE for now. As we are rolling out releases quicker, we need to take smaller steps. We can improve these after we do the work to make them work in all text areas."

    My apologies for not being clear - I'm not asking about which smileys, but rather how this will be implemented, and I suppose to play it safe - can this be Enabled/Disabled (like I can do with my existing 3rd-Party Actiivty Feed)?  As I've said so many times before, very little should be implemented without the ability to Enable/Disable the function(ality).  I personally don't want to be forced into a load additional http requests when loading pages.

    ################

     

    ==>"4.9.4 will have a few bug fixes but this release focuses on our certified marketplace and enhancements for that. We will have a lot of great things coming in upcoming releases. As we get closer to those, we'll put out roadmaps for those."

    1.  RE Roadmaps: Are you referring to pre or post 4.10?  I was referring to between now and 4.10.  At github as you obviously know, there were ways to code the posts (FRs, bug reports, etc.) with the stage(s).  I'm trying to see what will be coming soon from the FR list, and I'm somewhat confused because typically SE Roadmaps are only published for 'bigger' releases (such as 4.9, 4.10).

    2.  How is 4.09.04 release related/integrated with the Certified Marketplace?

    ################

     

    Question#02: When will licensing (keys, checks, etc.) be addressed?

    ==>"4.9.4 if I am grasping what you are asking."

    I wasn't clear enough between my Questions#02/03.  My apologies.

    RE Q#02: With licensing and keys, I was referring to callbacks.  Referring to previous discussions (previous community here as well as github) it seemed that SE may have been considering this being performed through a process at SE in order to eliminate all the mess/hassle that many 3rd-Party Plugins/Themes currently do.  What are the plans with this (not just when, but how is SE planning on addressing this)?  What is being done to ease the burden dumped on legitimately-licensed ADMINs that is caused by illegally-licensed pirates?

     

    ################

    Question#03: When will elimination of Dev Cores be addressed?  I currently have 5 sets of Cores downloading on almost every page (even pages that don't use any Plugins from that Dev, such as the Login and LP that use items from only 1 3rd-Party Dev).

    Thx.

    ==>"4.9.4 for license callbacks. As they need their utilities, we are trying to come up with a solution for that as it could create more load if you have to load the same files x the amount of plugins you have from a developer. "

    RE Q#03 I was referring more to the other stuff in Cores, not licensing (as that was questioned in #02).  There are many issues here, but two specifically are:

    Q#03-1:  Not loading files (Cores or otherwise) of Plugins that aren't needed for a particular page.  It seems that the shotgun approach seems to often be used - always load stuff whether it's needed or not (easy and simple for a Dev to do, but horrible on the performance/load side for ADMINs).

    Q#03-2:  Not loading files (like Core .js, .css, etc.) all the time.  There has to be a better way to say 'hey - if I already have this, don't download; if I don't then do download).

    ################

     

    I apologize for all the questions here, so if you feel I should address these elsewhere and/or create FRs for anything, just say so and I'll do that :)


    This post was edited by gs at August 11, 2017 3:46 PM EDT
    • 32 posts
    August 11, 2017 3:41 PM EDT

    With the Networks update, Will this incorporate the feature request I raised ages ago on github, that additional questions and answers can be added so specific networks can be made?

    Also will profile signup and questions be all updated and use of selectorize tags etc, like mentioned before?

    • Moderator
    • 379 posts
    August 11, 2017 4:01 PM EDT
    Daniel said:

    With the Networks update, Will this incorporate the feature request I raised ages ago on github, that additional questions and answers can be added so specific networks can be made?

    Also will profile signup and questions be all updated and use of selectorize tags etc, like mentioned before?

    Not yet. I mentioned above that we need to take smaller steps. Well it looks like smaller but it's actually a big change for flash and networks and profile types. So once these are fixed/improved, we can look at doing more to them. First, we need to bring them up to speed. :)

    The tags you mention will come after as more of an improvement as we need to test that well too. 

    • Moderator
    • 379 posts
    August 11, 2017 4:07 PM EDT
    gs said:

    ==>"These will be basic smileys like you see in this TinyMCE for now. As we are rolling out releases quicker, we need to take smaller steps. We can improve these after we do the work to make them work in all text areas."

    My apologies for not being clear - I'm not asking about which smileys, but rather how this will be implemented, and I suppose to play it safe - can this be Enabled/Disabled (like I can do with my existing 3rd-Party Actiivty Feed)?  As I've said so many times before, very little should be implemented without the ability to Enable/Disable the function(ality).  I personally don't want to be forced into a load additional http requests when loading pages.

    ################

     

    ==>"4.9.4 will have a few bug fixes but this release focuses on our certified marketplace and enhancements for that. We will have a lot of great things coming in upcoming releases. As we get closer to those, we'll put out roadmaps for those."

    1.  RE Roadmaps: Are you referring to pre or post 4.10?  I was referring to between now and 4.10.  At github as you obviously know, there were ways to code the posts (FRs, bug reports, etc.) with the stage(s).  I'm trying to see what will be coming soon from the FR list, and I'm somewhat confused because typically SE Roadmaps are only published for 'bigger' releases (such as 4.9, 4.10).

    2.  How is 4.09.04 release related/integrated with the Certified Marketplace?

    ################

     

    Question#02: When will licensing (keys, checks, etc.) be addressed?

    ==>"4.9.4 if I am grasping what you are asking."

    I wasn't clear enough between my Questions#02/03.  My apologies.

    RE Q#02: With licensing and keys, I was referring to callbacks.  Referring to previous discussions (previous community here as well as github) it seemed that SE may have been considering this being performed through a process at SE in order to eliminate all the mess/hassle that many 3rd-Party Plugins/Themes currently do.  What are the plans with this (not just when, but how is SE planning on addressing this)?  What is being done to ease the burden dumped on legitimately-licensed ADMINs that is caused by illegally-licensed pirates?

     

    ################

    Question#03: When will elimination of Dev Cores be addressed?  I currently have 5 sets of Cores downloading on almost every page (even pages that don't use any Plugins from that Dev, such as the Login and LP that use items from only 1 3rd-Party Dev).

    Thx.

    ==>"4.9.4 for license callbacks. As they need their utilities, we are trying to come up with a solution for that as it could create more load if you have to load the same files x the amount of plugins you have from a developer. "

    RE Q#03 I was referring more to the other stuff in Cores, not licensing (as that was questioned in #02).  There are many issues here, but two specifically are:

    Q#03-1:  Not loading files (Cores or otherwise) of Plugins that aren't needed for a particular page.  It seems that the shotgun approach seems to often be used - always load stuff whether it's needed or not (easy and simple for a Dev to do, but horrible on the performance/load side for ADMINs).

    Q#03-2:  Not loading files (like Core .js, .css, etc.) all the time.  There has to be a better way to say 'hey - if I already have this, don't download; if I don't then do download).

    ################

     

    I apologize for all the questions here, so if you feel I should address these elsewhere and/or create FRs for anything, just say so and I'll do that :)

    Gee wow that's a lot lol.

    All of the improvements being added have been fleshed out with settings and things we need in order to manage our sites (I mean we admins). Ray wants to make sure these are done with the least load to the site.

    Regarding cores. We need to work on that issue. We haven't found the best solution yet.

    Regarding callbacks. Those will be via our certified marketplace so the certified products will have a callback only to our store for licensing check. Experts that participate will have that option to help fight piracy but nothing will ever stop piracy. We can only try to make things better. 

    Regarding why 4.9.4 is mainly for the certified marketplace, see my paragraph above. :) It will also have a few bugs fixed but we don't want to introduce too much in each version as we want to make sure things work well.

    If you have more questions, I would appreciate it if you do one at a time next time LOL. It's a bit much to find all of them in the quote. 


    This post was edited by Donna at August 11, 2017 4:08 PM EDT
  • gs
    • 149 posts
    August 11, 2017 4:29 PM EDT

    ==>"All of the improvements being added have been fleshed out with settings and things we need in order to manage our sites (I mean we admins). Ray wants to make sure these are done with the least load to the site."

    So, does this mean that there will be an Enable/Disable setting for the Smileys (so we ADMINs can decide whether or not we want the performance hit)?

     

  • gs
    • 149 posts
    August 11, 2017 4:32 PM EDT

    RE: Roadmaps, FRs, and future releases

    How/where will we be notified of tentative plans for the FRs (like SE used to provide on github)?  Is SE going to provide a Roadmap for 4.09.04, 4.09.05, 4.09.06, etc all the way through 4.10 (and beyond)?  I (as well as other ADMINs) am seeking more info along the way (at a minimum of what SE provided at github, but hopefully even more info).  Thanks.

     

    • 32 posts
    August 11, 2017 4:36 PM EDT
    Donna said:
    Daniel said:

    With the Networks update, Will this incorporate the feature request I raised ages ago on github, that additional questions and answers can be added so specific networks can be made?

    Also will profile signup and questions be all updated and use of selectorize tags etc, like mentioned before?

    Not yet. I mentioned above that we need to take smaller steps. Well it looks like smaller but it's actually a big change for flash and networks and profile types. So once these are fixed/improved, we can look at doing more to them. First, we need to bring them up to speed. :)

    The tags you mention will come after as more of an improvement as we need to test that well too. 

     

     

    arrrr ok

  • gs
    • 149 posts
    August 11, 2017 4:41 PM EDT

    ==>"Regarding callbacks. Those will be via our certified marketplace so the certified products will have a callback only to our store for licensing check. Experts that participate will have that option to help fight piracy but nothing will ever stop piracy. We can only try to make things better."

    1.  RE Piracy: I realize that nothing will stop the experts, but just like security, some things could be done to make it closer to impossible to make nulled code funtional.  What is SE considering in this regard?

    2.  Certified products ...Store: So how will this work for Plugins/Themes already purchased (i.e. since they won't be 'through the store')?

    3.  RE Callback to SE: How often will this be done?

    4.  RE Callback to SE: How will it work (i.e. shut our site down?  issue a warning to SE for investigation?  etc.)? Who gets to decide what's legitimately licensed and what is ADMINs options (i.e. provide invoices to SE, etc.)?

    ==>"If you have more questions, I would appreciate it if you do one at a time next time LOL. It's a bit much to find all of them in the quote. "

    Sorry - I realize you wanted questions 1 at a time, but I'm trying (I broke things into 3 pieces this time).  At least these are basic questions all related to one specific issue.  This is why I prefer nested instead of quotes :)  But everyone has their own preferences and I like quotes for small snippets, but then there's no control/limit to the # of nested quotes (which can obviously get quite long).


    This post was edited by gs at August 11, 2017 4:45 PM EDT
    • Moderator
    • 379 posts
    August 12, 2017 5:03 AM EDT
    gs said:

    ==>"All of the improvements being added have been fleshed out with settings and things we need in order to manage our sites (I mean we admins). Ray wants to make sure these are done with the least load to the site."

    So, does this mean that there will be an Enable/Disable setting for the Smileys (so we ADMINs can decide whether or not we want the performance hit)?

     

    It's on the list of settings for this. 

    • Moderator
    • 379 posts
    August 12, 2017 5:05 AM EDT
    gs said:

    RE: Roadmaps, FRs, and future releases

    How/where will we be notified of tentative plans for the FRs (like SE used to provide on github)?  Is SE going to provide a Roadmap for 4.09.04, 4.09.05, 4.09.06, etc all the way through 4.10 (and beyond)?  I (as well as other ADMINs) am seeking more info along the way (at a minimum of what SE provided at github, but hopefully even more info).  Thanks.

     

    Later when we have our feature/bug section here made, you'll see more like that. For now, you'll have updates via blog/forum. Since 4.9.4 is mainly for the marketplace, we don't have a roadmap as it's coming soon. 

    • Moderator
    • 379 posts
    August 12, 2017 5:10 AM EDT
    gs said:

    ==>"Regarding callbacks. Those will be via our certified marketplace so the certified products will have a callback only to our store for licensing check. Experts that participate will have that option to help fight piracy but nothing will ever stop piracy. We can only try to make things better."

    1.  RE Piracy: I realize that nothing will stop the experts, but just like security, some things could be done to make it closer to impossible to make nulled code funtional.  What is SE considering in this regard?

    --As I said, the marketplace for certified plugins/themes/languages. Those will be purchased in the marketplace only. Only licensed clients can purchase. If those get pirated then we know someone with a license shared them. That's actually pretty easy to track down.

    2.  Certified products ...Store: So how will this work for Plugins/Themes already purchased (i.e. since they won't be 'through the store')?

    --We plan on a blog announcing and explaining the marketplace. We hadn't intended on doing that right now. :) As a short answer, webhooks and experts updates.

    3.  RE Callback to SE: How often will this be done?

    --I'll answer just these for now about the market as we were not prepared to have a full disclosure until we got out blog out. Once upon install/updates.

    4.  RE Callback to SE: How will it work (i.e. shut our site down?  issue a warning to SE for investigation?  etc.)? Who gets to decide what's legitimately licensed and what is ADMINs options (i.e. provide invoices to SE, etc.)?

    --We'll answer things like this once I know the details. I have no idea what you are asking. Note that only those with no SocialEngine license should be concerned about this sort of thing...

    ==>"If you have more questions, I would appreciate it if you do one at a time next time LOL. It's a bit much to find all of them in the quote. "

    Sorry - I realize you wanted questions 1 at a time, but I'm trying (I broke things into 3 pieces this time).  At least these are basic questions all related to one specific issue.  This is why I prefer nested instead of quotes :)  But everyone has their own preferences and I like quotes for small snippets, but then there's no control/limit to the # of nested quotes (which can obviously get quite long).

    We will not answer more marketplace questions until we have the marketplace blog ready as some answers I don't have yet and I don't want to get into things that aren't ready yet. Thank you!

  • gs
    • 149 posts
    August 12, 2017 12:02 PM EDT

    4.  RE Callback to SE: How will it work (i.e. shut our site down?  issue a warning to SE for investigation?  etc.)? Who gets to decide what's legitimately licensed and what is ADMINs options (i.e. provide invoices to SE, etc.)?

    --We'll answer things like this once I know the details. I have no idea what you are asking. Note that only those with no SocialEngine license should be concerned about this sort of thing...

    Actually, yes those with valid license should be concerned since we have no clue how SE will be handling it, and SE seems to have little actual control over what many Devs do in certain instances.  So yes, I'm concerned.  I've had Devs lie to me (i.e. callback only on install, then later on license/key issue pops up due to bug which requires them to fix).

    This is a huge uncertainty for ADMINs right now, and few rollouts of any software updates by any business/developer are bug-free (so this is not directed at SE, just the way the software world is).

    As far as what I'm asking it's quite simple (but as you also mentioned, you won't be answering things like this until later).  I'm asking exactly what I wrote: How will it work?  Will SE issue a warning to ADMIN if there's an issue with licensing?  Will issues be treated as warnings until investigation is complete (will there even be an investigation)?  Will our site simply be shutdown until someone validates something somehow?  These are some of the questions that could be addressed when it's time to do so.  Were any ADMINs contacted for input on this process? 

    Another issue is if this will require us to update to 4.09.04 or can we keep what we've got?  As you can imagine, it's often very costly (time, money, resources) to implement new revisions, so this is another concern that I personally don't want to wait until a blog post down the road to tell me whether I'm stuck or not.  It took me 3 months to prepare for and implement 4.09.02 (and that's without actually installing 4.09.00 and 4.09.01.

    If this discussion should be moved elsewhere please let me know, as I realize it's off the path of 4.10.


    This post was edited by gs at August 12, 2017 12:09 PM EDT
    • Moderator
    • 379 posts
    August 12, 2017 3:05 PM EDT

    I will just say this as I don't think you are grasping what I am saying. The certified plugins will be licensed and sold through our marketplace. Our terms state no callbacks (other than api for mobile app which is special). We will test the plugins. We will not allow developer callbacks. The only check will be to our marketplace when a client installs a plugin they bought from the marketplace (certified). When you go to install that plugin, the check is made just like it does now for installs and upgrades. That's it. It checks for your purchase from the marketplace for that certified plugin only. Nothing more. If no license for that plugin exists, it won't install. No harm will come to the site at all.

    For those that want to use certified plugins, yes, you will need to upgrade to 4.9.4. We will answer more questions about 4.9.4 and the marketplace when we make our blog and posts about it. This thread is ONLY for 4.10. Thank you.

    • 32 posts
    August 12, 2017 6:57 PM EDT

    Question#02: When will licensing (keys, checks, etc.) be addressed?

    4.9.4 if I am grasping what you are asking.





    what, licencsing checks, please dont say the software is going to do live daily checks back to each server ie Social Engine, and all the devs servers of plugins.

    If any of these sites were to go down that would affect my site greatly, not to mention if anyone closed up shop and stopped developing.

    I will 100% move away from SE if this does that


    This post was edited by Daniel at August 12, 2017 6:58 PM EDT
    • 32 posts
    August 12, 2017 7:07 PM EDT
    gs said:

    Actually, yes those with valid license should be concerned since we have no clue how SE will be handling it, and SE seems to have little actual control over what many Devs do in certain instances.  So yes, I'm concerned.  I've had Devs lie to me (i.e. callback only on install, then later on license/key issue pops up due to bug which requires them to fix).


    Im actually really concerned now about licencing, I was about to buy more plugins etc.
    But if there is live daily checks to check all licences, I will move away from SE straight away. 

    I had issue once with plugin from a dev, purchased, installed it, was working on the site and got errors and plugin stopped working.
    then 10 mins later it was fine and working no errors.
    Went to devs site to raise a ticket, started writing, hit send and error showed up for their site, typed home address and was just an error number.

    Refreshed my site page with their plugin, and got errors, disabled that plugin and site worked, enabled the plugin again, went to plugin menu, which showed its serial number for plugin, as you have to press save so it truely activates again to get all plugins settings, and error saying couldnt activate.

    I 100% do not want to ever experience that ever again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

    • 32 posts
    August 12, 2017 7:11 PM EDT

    @donna any idea when profile signup, profile questions etc will be addressed, before it was added via github to next release that suggested to 4.9.x but then it was said 4.10 milestone, but I get the feeling now that area, is not gunna be fixed or addressed until sometime even later.Its really the one area that bugs me as its not been changed since Social engine 3.

    And a document uploader for verfication documents NEEDS to be added.

    Networks needs to have ability to truely define a networks by multiselecting a combination of profile answer/questions.

    profile signup/browse members needs to act like a dating site.